I'm C.I. of The Common Ills and The Third Estate Sunday Review. A few basics. Ava is taking notes. When I'm not speaking, I'll be helping her there. We thank her for the note taking. Her stipulation for participation was she didn't want to speak. That's more than fine.
C.I. (Con't): We're using as an illustration a photograph of brave Iraqis in Samarra holding a message for the world -- and this photo belongs to Iraqi Spring MC. They are the official voice for the Iraqi Spring. The message is four sentences: "Obama, If you Cannot Hear Us Can you Not See Us? Wake Up, this is an IRAQI REVOLUTION Not a Sectarian One! Iraqis Did not Vote for an Iranian Dictatorship Women Rights in Democratic Iraq Are NON-EXISTENT!"
Marcia: What I found interesting was that the sign was in English -- and I was briefly puzzled, but then Ava told me --
Ava: To get the message out in the US, you pretty much have to put it in English. We're not France or Germany in that we can claim to speak multiple languages in large numbers.
Marcia: And of everyone participating in this, C.I.'s the only one who reads and speaks Arabic. Let me clear that up, we don't read it and we don't speak it. Rebecca, Elaine, Ann, Ruth, Ava and Wally speak more than one language. And for a group our size, that may be out of the norm -- we should probably, to be fully representative of America, have fewer who speak more than just English. But that was smart of the protesters to realize that and I really love that we'll all be reposting this roundtable at our sites and the thing that even the casual observer will see is this massive protest in Samarra and the sign they're holding.
Ann: I think it was also smart to put Barack Obama into the sign. It's smart because he does have a responsibility but it's also smart because it grabs Americans and plays on the reality that we are responsible -- along with England and Australia -- for the illegal war. I think it's smart and great that it gets Barack's name up there right at the start.
C.I.: You're saying, Ann, that there is guilt to be shared in America and that it plays to that guilt.
Ann: Right. It pulls you in. As an American, I read it and know my country started this continuing crime against the Iraqi people and by bringing in the American leader and basically saying, "What are you going to do?" -- it kicks the responsibility over to where it belongs.
Ruth: I agree and I am also impressed with the size of the turnout. This has been going on for months now, correct?
C.I.: Yes, since December 21st. Prior to that, in December, Moqtada al-Sadr, cleric and movement leader, had been insulted by Nouri al-Maliki, thug and prime minister. This had led his followers to take to the streets in large numbers. But in terms of ongoing protests, it's December 21st.
Ruth: And they have grown. They are sizable and this despite the fact that these protesters are targeted by Nouri's forces.
Cedric: January 25th, they were assaulted in Falluja and nine were killed. March 8th, 3 were killed in the attack in Mosul. And they were attacked by Nouri's forces. It's really amazing that we're sending Nouri weapons, we're spending billions of US dollars to prop up his government and he's attacking his own people.
Kat: It really is pathetic. And we were forewarned. What did Joe Biden say?
C.I.: When he was still in the Senate?
Kat: Uh-huh.
C.I.: April 10, 2008 he noted that the US was being asked "to take sides in Iraq's civil war" and, among other things, "We want to normalize a government that really doesn't exist."
Kat: And now he's vice president. And I'd just love an interviewer to read those comments back to him and ask him what the hell he thinks the US is doing in Iraq today? And I'm sick of liars like R. Jeffrey Smith -- in fact, since 2008, the so-called Center for Public Integrity has been one big joke.
Jim: I agree with you about the laughable Center for Public Integrity. What did Smith do?
Kat: Wrote an idiotic article. To believe his garbage and others, you have to be monumentally stupid and believe the US stopped spending money in Iraq under Bush. It didn't stop spending in 2011. It still spends. And we've got no real oversight of that money so you'd think a real reporter would be noting that. R. Jeffrey Smith is just another partisan whore, he's not a reporter.
Trina: Like Kat, I'm sick of all that crud. I'm sick of these jerks and asses who think they can write their anti-Bush rhetoric and pretend like they did something.
Ava: Jumping in again even though I said I wouldn't. Trina, you're not saying you're pro-Bush, clarify that because some reader will misunderstand.
Trina: Thank you. No, I'm not pro-Bush. But I'm sick of these writer who write their partisan whoring. There's a lot to blame Barack on -- and not just voting on all the funding as a senator. There's a lot to blame him on as president. It's when he's president that Nouri loses the vote but Barack forces him off on Iraqis -- via The Erbil Agreement -- as a prime minister for another term. It is under Barack, not Bully Boy Bush, that Iraq's Emo youth and LGBT community is targeted with death in such ghastly and public ways that it actually gets serious media attention. And the White House response? Never to speak of it.
Marcia: I see something like that and just wonder how anyone can get away with that. Barack has been so awful for human rights around the world. And with Iraq wanting those F-16s next year -- over 30 in all -- I'd say the White House could do a lot to improve human rights in Iraq by setting serious conditions before the delivery of even one jet.
C.I.: Last week, Ruth wrote "Brett McGurk spits in Iraqi women's faces," Rebecca, any thoughts?
Rebecca: Brett McGurk was Barack's third nominee to be US Ambassador to Iraq in Barack's first term. He didn't become the ambassador. Turned out, he had an inappropriate relationship with a reporter, Gina Chon, while he was in Iraq during the Bush years. In Iraq, there is such a thing as 'honor' killings. That's where someone thinks I've brought disgrace to our family so a family member kills me. Brett McGurk is now known in Iraq as the adulterer. As the American who came to Iraq and didn't respect the sanctity of marriage. To be clear, I've divorced multiple times. I'm not talking here about my own values. I'm talking about Iraq. Which would have been the host country if McGurk had been confirmed as ambassador. Now it's being reported that Deputy Assistant Secretary of State for Iraq and Iran will be McGurk. As you've pointed out, there's no way he goes to Iraq and women are comfortable around him. They have a private meeting with him and it's "Slut! You've disgraced the family!" And the woman could be killed just for meeting -- or being thought to have met -- with Brett McGurk. Why would you want to select anyone for a post if you knew that half the country would be unable to interact with the person?
Isaiah: What McGurk has going for him in Barack's mind is that McGurk and Nouri are tight. Iraqiya lodged a complaint when the administration first announced McGurk was the nominee for US Ambassador to Iraq. This time around, I think if they were to launch a campaign like, "Keep Iraqi women safe, Keep Brett McGurk out of Iraq," it would be enough to kill his chances of being the Deputy Assistant Secretary of State for Iraq and Iran.
C.I.: Isaiah, why do you feel that Barack sees the close relationship McGurk and Nouri have as a good thing?
Isaiah: Because Barack's primary goal is to preserve Nouri as prime minister.
Wally: Right, they're not even -- the administration -- saying anything about Nouri's decision to run for a third term. That's not announced but it's known by the fact that the law Parliament just passed limiting the prime minister to two terms is one Nouri keeps appealing to the federal court.
Stan: And as Wally knows, it also -- that law -- covers the president of Iraq and the Speaker of Parliment. All three are limited to two terms. The Constitution already limited the president.
Wally: Right. What we see under Barack is a disregard for the safety and comfort of the Iraqi people. He just wants to keep the puppet installed and he will -- and he has -- overlook anything in order to keep Nouri in power.
Stan: I feel very sorry for the Iraqi people.
Wally: Support.
Stan: They went to the polls in 2010 and their voters were tossed aside because Barack had to have Nouri get a second term. Can you imagine that? Some pushy foreigners invade your country, tear it apart and tell you, 'hey, we brought you democracy!' Then you go to vote in the elections, you risk violence, and what happens is that your vote gets tossed aside because those same damn foreigners who invaded now refuse to let your country's voice be heard. How could you even use the term democracy after that except as a punch line to a bad joke?
C.I.: Strong points all. Stan, last week you wrote about counter-insurgency in "What the US government did in Iraq," Did you want to talk about that?
Stan: Well you and Ava covered the documentary James Steele: America's Myster Man In Iraq in "TV: The War Crimes Documentary" and I think that really captures it. My point in writing that post was really just to be on record calling out counter-insurgency. And I think if people really gave a damn about political prisoner and whistle blower Bradley Manning, they would talk about the realities of counter-insurgency. That doesn't happen and so I wanted to be on record and I also wanted to back up you and Elaine who have covered this topic for years.
C.I.: I agree with you, Stan, it is important to be on the record opposing counter-insurgency. It amazes me that we think a 'debate' is on whether it's effective or not and not on how outrageous war on a native people itself is. Mike, Elaine and Betty haven't spoken yet. So, as we wind down, I want to toss to them. What is the story that stands out most to you with regards to the Iraq War? Betty, would you like to go first?
Betty: I certainly would. I'll go with the March 12, 2006, gang-rape and murder of Abeer Qassim Hamza al-Janabi. To me that really was one of the biggest stories. Also one of the most telling. For any who don't know, Abeer was a young teenager. 14-years-old. And American soldiers, with Steven D. Green as ringleader, plotted to rape her. They entered her family home, the gang-rape began with two soldiers -- one holding Abeer down while the other had his turn at rape -- and Green went into the other room with the parents and Abeer's five-year-old sister. Abeer was being raped and could hear the gun shots -- and probably the screams -- of her parents and her baby sister as she was being raped. And how awful that she's being gang-raped but she also knows that she's going to die. At that moment, she knows. "I must get out of this"? That line from Tori Amos' "Me and A Gun." Where the woman is getting raped and she's thinking about bisquits and anything else to try to leave her body during this horrific crime and she's telling herself "I must get out of this." But before the gang-rape was over, Abeer knew she wouldn't. She heard the gun shots and I'm sure there were screams and cries and that she heard those as well.
Mike: Right. She hears all of that, like Betty said. And I agree, there were screams and cries. Steven D. Green is shooting the little five-year-old girl, the mother and the father. I would assume that the father being the strongest that he shoots him first. And that has the mother and daughter screaming and crying. And Abeer hears that gun shot and the cries and screams. Then another gun shot. Then a third. And nothing. And then Steven D. Green's in the room and the other two US soldiers step away and Green begins raping Abeer. And she knows this man raping her is the man who just killed her parents and her kid sister. And she knows he's going to kill her. And he does. Then, to try to hide their War Crimes, they set her body on fire. It's just disgusting. And it's really like the story of the illegal war. America was going to 'help.' And Green was stationed in the corner of Abeer's block to provide security, to 'help.' And instead, he starts lusting after this 14-year-old girl, staring at her, he can't keep his hands to himself and she complains to her parents and they get a relative who'll take Abeer in. But the night before she leaves, Green and company break into her house and that's that.
Elaine: I'm going to agree with Betty and Mike. I think it was telling. I think Mike's right about how it is basically a metaphor for the US actions in Iraq. I agree with Betty's logical conclusion that Abeer heard screams and cries while she was being raped -- and gun shots. But what I'd point out was that we saw the reaction to Abeer.
C.I.: Which was?
Elaine: Silence. Jane Fonda gave a great speech about her. But Women's Media Center, which Fonda's a part of, could have amplified the speech, could have given the story life. They ignored it. So many other outlets did as well. There were several military trials of the soldiers involved. Steven D. Green, the ringleader, had a civilian trial because he'd already left the military. There was no rush to cover it. This is after the others have confessed their crimes. Green is the last one tried. The Nation wasn't interested, Democracy Now! didn't give a damn. That's just to name a few. My point being that the War Crimes -- and that's what was done to Abeer and her family, War Crimes -- were ignored by the bulk of the media. This let us know how unimportant Iraq was to so many in the press -- no matter how often they used it during a pledge cycle to beg for more money.
C.I.: Okay. If I missed anyone, now's your chance to say so? No one. Okay, I promised Jim he could wrap it up.
Jim: The big takeaway for me with Iraq isn't that the US screwed things up in 2003. It's that the US continues to screw things up. The US government has prevented the 2010 election results from being honored, to give one example. And there's been too much appeasing Nouri. I want everyone reading this to get that we have called out the appeasement of Nouri al-Maliki. If he gets a third term, as he wants, he's in for life. He moves from Little Saddam to Big Saddam. I want people to realize that and realize that it was called out in real time. The US puppets don't turn into tyrants over time. They're selected to be installed because they already are tyrants. And 20 years from now when President Lady GaGa is saying we have to invade Iraq to save the Iraqis from Nouri al-Maliki, I want people to remember that everyone didn't stick their heads in the sand and play dumb in real time.
C.I.: Alright. Thank you, Jim. This is a rush transcript and we thank everyone who participated. Most of all, we thank the Iraqi people for their courage and strength to go on day after day, even after repeatedly facing the wrath of the US government.
